My Sunday column promised that my blog would feature a copy of the outline that Karen Floyd’s campaign had sent me as a guide to what she would propose to do as superintendent of education.
I couldn’t lay hands on it over the weekend (we recently changed e-mail servers, and I
had lost the message from her campaign with that attachment), so I linked you to a lame photograph of a black-and-white printout of the "plan." (I had printed it out to have in front of me during last week’s debate.) Well, that hardly met this blog’s standards.
So here’s a link
to the original PDF, as it was sent to me. I’ll go back and replace it in the other post as well.
Once again, if you can put together her description of her plans during the debate and this outline and come up with something coherent, then my hat is off to you, Gunga Din.
Related Posts
The “position papers” she “proferred” back in early May when I read through them were composed of the following:
1. School choice
2. Diverse Provider Model: Private management for low achieving schools, based on a plan used for less than 4 years in Philadelphia.
3. Safety and School violence
4. The PACT doesn’t provide meaningful data.
This color blindness test you received includes:
technology
growth model
technology infusion
Disengaged children
She leaves out “oversight” that was in the traditional model because private schools don’t have any oversight.
She now actually mentions students? Her position papers focus on parents, PACT, privitization, and oh ya, violent students.
She now includes technology? Guess that’s the cameras in the classroom.
Growth model? Is that for the out of state lobbyist money that’s pouring into her campaign?
Brad,
Would you have considered just posting the information without editorializing, or without including the petty, parting shot at Mrs. Floyd?
Chris
Chrisw, would you have considered posting some data ANY DATA to justify your claims that SC middle and elementary schools are at the bottom?
I never said that.
What information?
Chris, I’ll answer for Brad. You can forget it. Brad will be petty and take cheap shots at every opportunity, so as to run Karen Floyd and her “plan” into the ditch as often as he can. As an example, please note that he can’t even force himself to write the word *plan* at the top of this blog string without quotation marks. This is the same cheap, underhanded and cowardly tactic he used incessantly in his editorials and articles discussing the Put Parents in Charge (PPIC) Act earlier this year. It shows his lack of character and his utter disdain and lack of respect for any of us vermin who dare to disagree with his righteous view of things. Get used to it Chris. This is quintessential Brad Warthen. Ed
That’s why they call it “Drive by Journalism”.
By the way, where are the details of the “Rex Plan”?
Where, in his 30 year career, did he implement any of these items succesfully?
Guys….it is hilarious reading your dribble. Or it would be if the stakes weren’t so high. Truth is truth regardless of your opinion. The truth is that Karen Floyd is an imposter when it comes to education reform. I called and spoke to her on the radio back in June. My question was, “Where did you get your insight and information regarding effective education reform?”
Her response was, “I hired 4 experts who did research for me. Out of that I composed my position papers. This took over a month.”
This is ridiculous and demonstrates the lack of respect that politicians (not to mention the public) has for the profession of education.
Bottom line…go and read. Read the research of such education reformers as Schlecty, Reaves, DuFour, Stiggins, MacTighe, etc.
None of these talk about such insane things such as taking drivers licenses away from discipline problems – that is about as stupid as taking credit cards away from shoplifters. It makes no difference. It is not addressing the problem in a proactive manner.
Education is power and we have so many public school teachers who are dedicated to helping each and every student in their classrooms achieve success. Our teachers and schools are working hard towards reform. They accept and embrace accountability even as we are disgraced by the ignorance of those outside the profession.
Karen Floyd may win the position…but she will be just like Sanford, she will accomplish nothing towards real reform because she won’t lead those she is responsible for. She is an impostor.
James, I actually think you may be right about Karen Floyd not being able lead, but for a different reason. I don’t think she will fail to lead, I think that the huge and entrenched bureaucracy will refuse to be led…ie do the right thing and work with her. None of the educrats and flying monkeys in the SC educational system will see it as in their best interest to cooperate with an “outsider” like Floyd, and you can bet that their own interests are all they care about. I wish we could blow this whole educational establishment up and start over. Seems to me the only way to get anywhere near that ideal is to put a voucher system in place immediately and drain away students and resources so that the bureaucracy atrophies and dries up as a result. Bottom line, in the end it isn’t about Floyd being able to lead the unleadable, it’s about Floyd offering parents a new and better way and letting the old system die the death. Ed
Folks, what you take as snideness is merely an explanation. I don’t think it would be fair to either Mrs. Floyd or me to say that that chart was her whole expression of her platform. Nor did I want you to think that I though I was giving you something of substance.
When she met with the editorial board, she talked at some length about her “traditional” and “non-traditional” boxes, and how various concepts fit withint various boxes under those headings, and we were asking questions such as “wait; does this go under this or under that.” She got Hogan Gidley to put together something to represent the overall structure of the ideas graphically.
The best I can do to flesh it out for you is to ask you to go to the streaming video, because early in the debate she was sort of speaking from that outline. Personally, I don’t get a whole lot of order and coherence out of it even then, but maybe you will…
And yes, Randy, her most extended efforts to set out full-blown policy positions was in those four brief documents to which I referred in my column (where you can find the links).
Ed, maybe you can answer this. What evidence do you or Floyd have that the middle and elementary schools are “at the bottom”? Despite her claim of “several” examples of our schools being at the bottom, Floyd has only offered two – drop out rates and SAT. These are metrics used for high schools.
I’m waiting for justification to make our state a guinea pig for the out of state voucher lobbyists. Maybe you can justify your demonization of our school system with some FACTS or DATA.
This is Earth calling! Earth calling to Brad Warthen! Are we reaching you? Can you hear us now?
This is an outline/overview only. You may have seen something like this from your new McClatchy bosses, assuming you didn’t fall asleep during the presentation(s). It is not intended to stand alone. The whole point is to provide talking points, points which are then verbally fleshed out by Karen Floyd (yeah, and I can just see you yukking it up during her interview in your very solemn and serious “candidate interviews”). Her opponent can’t even produce that much but since he curries favor with you (= “sucks up to you” for public school students) we won’t hear much about his shortcomings.
For shame! Where’s your unpartyism? Good thing people aren’t paying much attention to you or your paper except for the Sunday sales flyers.
Randy, I had occasion to work on projects with union steel workers (USW union) and in your disdain for Floyd’s ideas you sound just like one of those union blokes. Basically, they all know more than management, had an adversarial attitude toward their employer, thought that success on the job meant getting a position where you got paid the most while doing the least, and were very smug about the union protecting them for a permanent lifetime of employment. You may not belong to the USW but Ithink some educators in this state have the USW attitude. It wont be easy for Floyd or anyone else to alter that kind of thinking but school choice and vouchers are a start. With the USW, in many cases the last laugh was on them as the Japanese and others came in and beat them on quality, THANKS to free market forces. This is what is needed with the state education system.
Dave, you made a good analogy of public education being like the steel workers union. I had the experience in 1985 of doing a consulting job for US Steel in Pittsburgh at the same time I was doing a small one for Nucor in Darlington. What a difference in attitudes.
A few years later, those union steel workers who refused to take a cut in their $67,000 jobs had no jobs. The Nucor workers makeing $37,000 were receiving $30,000 bonuses. Today, they are making more. The USW boys are doing odd jobs.
Dave, your critique of me is little more than throwing out labels like “liberal”. It’s simplistic and unsubstantiated.
My disdain was channeled towards Rex as well. Why? Because they are NOT addressing the real problems in education. I’ll stick with Floyd because you brought her up.
Her plan was limited to 4 areas, NONE of which addresses the behavior nor the responsibilty of students aside from VIOLENT students. She talks almost exclusively about privitization and the PACT. It’s clear to me that as an outsider she simply doesn’t understand what we face or she is focused on the political aspects that will get her elected.
She also piles on us teachers with her school hater message. In her bus commercial, she claims our schools are “at the bottom”. ONCE AGAIN, I challenged anyone here to provide data that shows our middle and elementary schools are at the bottom. Floyd mentions drop out rate and SAT. That’s high school only. I am at a high school that is not even close to the bottom. So she has nothing to offer us?
I have consistently beat the drums of discontent with these candidates because they are not addressing the real issues that will improve our system. There is a great deal more to this than some union worker discontent, as you so simply characterize it.
Randy, I don’t hate or demonize the good teachers we presently have in our public schools. I believe they generally do a yeomans’ job and are to be commended. So I have no animus towards you personally, heck I don’t even know you, but you seem to do exactly what most defenders of the indefensible do when attempting to cast our public schools in a good light. You cherry pick some statistic or other that is really meaningless when taken out of context, and then try to build a case to support whatever position it is that you’ve taken. Case in point: You proudly claim that our elementary and middle schools are “not at the bottom” as though that somehow ought to make us proud, when the greater context is that reading and math levels are really pretty poor, and ultimately, whether elementary and middle schools are OK or not, they are not preparing kids to go on and graduate from high school. Our school system has good people in it, both teachers and students, but it is ON FIRE and it needs to be changed. Quickly too, because kids lives are being ruined as it now stands. Public ed would benefit tremendously from direct competition for resources and students. Karen Floyd believes in this idea, and she is fearless enough to try it. She hasn’t bashed teachers to my knowledge, but I can see how it might sound like she has to someone in the system when she’s been brutally honest about the shape that system is in. Don’t be threatened Randy, embrace the new ideas. If you are a good and conscientious teacher, you will do fine in a competitive arena. Ed
Ed, our middle and elementary schools are at the median or higher on 5 out of 8 national tests. That’s not the excellent, but it’s not the “bottom” as Floyd claims. This is why I make the point that we are not “at the bottom.”
You accuse me of “cherry picking”. I have pointed out the ONLY data I’ve seen so far that compares our middle and elementary schools with the other states in apples to apples fashion. How is that cherry picking?
By the way, do you have ANY DATA, let alone cherry picked data? I’ll be surprised if you give a straight forward reply. I bet you will rely on your own perception or claim it’s obvious that the schools are poor. You claim they don’t prepare students for high school. DATA? EVIDENCE?
I embrace new ideas Ed, I simply don’t embrace bad ideas. I’m not threatened, I encourage accountability. Let’s see you practice some accountability and justify your claims with some EVIDENCE.
Exactly what evidence would you like me to cite? I’m only as good as the numbers that I read in places like “The State,” and of course they’ve got a serious love-jones on for the status quo, as you do, so their numbers are skewed and manipulated. Shucks, you’re the insider…you tell me what the high school graduation rate is. What is it for black males? What is it when compared to grad rates and per-pupil spending of other states? Are you seriously arguing that there is not a LOT of improvement that needs to be made and made quickly? Are you really saying that there isn’t a LOT of redundant and duplicative (Brads’ favorite word) administrative bureaucracy, wasting money that could be spent much more intelligently on classrooms? You’re right, I don’t have numbers at my fingertips, but I can read, and I can see. And I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night. Ed
“The State” has endorsed Ravenel for State Treasurer purely on the basis that he isn’t as bad as the other guy. Thus, I will take my cue from Brad Warthen and say this: I support Karen Floyd for State Super of Ed on the basis that she won’t screw things up any worse than they already are in our school system. If this kind of reasoning is good enough for Brad, it’s good enough for me. Ed
Prediction comes true:
Randy: “Ed, do you have any evidence that SC elementary and middle schools are at the bottom aside from your own perception?”
Ed: “You’re right, I don’t have numbers at my finger tips but I can read. I can see.” [sic]
Thanks for proving my point. Please share some more of your omnipotent insight of the world according to Ed.
Ed, you use the same tiresome script. You state that your position and insight are true because you deem it so, despite being unsubstantiated. Then you discredit any contrary evidence as skewed and dismiss the person who takes issue with your lack of evidence or any justification as “being for the status quo”. This phallacy assumes there are no other options.
I am not for the status quo and have been critical of Rex as well. BUT, I am not for BAD reform either, especially when the leading proponent is lacking in data and evidence.
Are you really suggesting that we should make major decisions about the majority of our state budget based on Ed and Karen’s assumptions and perceptions?
Reandy, you’re the one who is so foamed up about the numbers. You’ve obviously got some that you think buttress your position dedicated to undying support for the status quo. I’ve never said it was about numbers for me, I just know a rat when I see one…more importantly I know it when I get forced to pay for one. And guys like you who love failure don’t impress me. I intend to continue to voice my opinions and support for change, and I intend to do it often, your objections notwithstanding. Ed
Yes Ed, who needs data any way. They don’t use it in the real world. Businesses don’t use data so why would a business model for schools need data. Drink that koolaid Ed.
“guys who love failure”? Lol, I had 85% passing rate for my 34 AP students last year. I also support accountability and meaningful change. I’ve bashed Rex for not providing meaningful reform initiatives. If I loved failure, I’d love your “plan” and support your unsubstantiated “opinions”.
I don’t blame you for shying away from evidence that undermines your blind ideology. No one likes to be made to look foolish.
Randy, since you’re so hot and steamed about those 2 tests out of 8 in 1 out of 4 years, how about giving us some stats, numbers, what-have-you, stating that our high schools are not at or near the bottom nationally. SAT scores and graduation rates clearly suggest that we are at the bottom. Do you have any high school numbers to make us think otherwise? Show us we’re not Number 49 or 50!! Prove that our own eyes and ears are lying to us!
Typical of ideologues to disregard any data which contradicts their blind opinion.
The bottom line is you and Floyd champion a “plan” as a solution for our “terrible schools”.
I provided data that shows that SC middle and elementary schools not only are NOT “49 out of 50”, but are at or above the median on 5 out of 8 national tests. All but 2 were last reported in 2005. Interestingly, those two were tests on which we didn’t do as well – just below the median.
You turn discussion away from this data that CONTRADICTS and proves you WRONG to focus on high schools.
Ok, I’m game. But first, you either provide some data to justify the need for your plan for the elementary and middle schools or simply admit, as Ed has, that you don’t have any evidence and you are propping up your claims with blind ideology.
Put up or shut up Lexie.
Randy, you are truly a conscientious and caring teacher as we can tell from the passion you put into this blog. What strikes me is that you are extremely frustrated because the system you work in either doesnt respond to your ideas or works to block them. I would be frustrated in that atmosphere also. So, you above many other people, should be looking to a Karen Floyd for innovation and change. Rex, as a longtime educational insider, will be highly unlikely to push for strong reforms. Think about it.
You keep going back to the middle and elementary school mantra Randy, is that all you got? For a guy who loves numbers and tries to ridicule anyone who can’t spout them, you don’t seem to have many that say what you think they do. This is pretty thin soup for a guy who wants to make the case that things are just fine, leave ’em alone. I’m not sayin, I’m just sayin. Ed
If middle schools are so great, why do about half of those promoted to high school drop out of high school?
Ed, again no data necessary from you. I’ve posted national norm-referenced data which compares states in apples to apples fashion. It shows that SC fares favorably with the other states.
You dismiss this as “just elementary and middle school” (tell that to parents with kids at those levels). If that’s the case, you must be admitting that we don’t need the Ed and Karen “plan” for vouchers for middle and elementary schools. Thanks for clearing that up.
Dave, I have thought about it and realize that there is good and bad in our current system. This is why I have been beating the drum of discontent with BOTH candidates.
Rex does little to address the serious problems we face in the classroom. As I predicted, he’d run mostly against Floyd as opposed to running on a set of reforms.
I take issue with Floyd for two reasons. She inaccurately paints a picture of our system. She has not provided any data that shows why our middle and elementary schools need a major overhaul. She’s given us two indicators; SAT and drop out rate. How do those two measures show our whole system needs an overhaul?
Also, she does not address the major issues in our classrooms such as discipline or how students can be held accountable. The only mention of students in her plan is to address VIOLENT students.
My posts have been in reply to the reckless use of a broad brush to analyze and disparage the educational system and administrators as a whole. This is too serious of an issue that requires more depth and analysis than “the market model will fix everything” followed by the simplistic assumption that anyone who does not drink this koolaid must support the status quo (as if those are the only two choices).
I am frustrated with many aspects of the system which I deal with often and much of which outsiders simply do not understand. Unfortunately, these issues are not addressed because the focus is on the agenda of a minority of proponents of a plan that has yet to be proven successful on a state wide level and which will not address the major problems I face.
DATA: Half those promoted from SC middle schools are illiterate and / or fail to be graduated from high school.
A 50% failure rate is significant evidence that something is seriously wrong with our middle schools.
I am not certain if any of you recall that until 1970 or there abouts, SC had a dual school system, one for African American students and one for White students. White taxpayers could decide to which system to send their tax money: the African American school system (out of the kindness of their hearts) or the White system. The bulk of the tax money went to upport the White schools. All schools were pretty much under-funded because the landed aristocracy and mill owners did not need a lot of uppity workers to doff the looms in the textile mills or pick the cotton from thier fields. As a result of this culture of mediocrity and low expectations, schools naturally produced workers for low wage jobs.
Finally, in the early 1980s, SC had a governor and a General Assembly who realized that education was a way to improve the lives of all of its citizens and to improve the state. They realized that this was not going to be a quick fix because of a 100 year tradition of not expecting much from our students. Incrememntal gains were made, and by the late 1990s, another governor and another General Assembly, following the lead of states all over the US, the Educational Accountability Act (EAA) introduced a new wave of standards and accountability for teachers and classrooms (but not students or parents). Students continue to make gains in standards that are among the most stringent in the nation, with more graduation requirements than in other states. I am afraid all of this talk about vouchers can be boiled down to very coded talk- racism in the clothing of a voucher.
We can’t expect to make changes over night. These things take time. SC is experiencing the same things that every other state is facing- drop out rates, declining achievement, 8th-9th grade transition, etc.
Children succeed in school when they are sent to school valuing education, with parents who are supportive of classroom teachers and are in some way involved in their child’s education- from simply checking to make sure that homeowrk is done to volunteering at school, time permitting.
Disaggregate SAT scores and you will see that even though our scores are low, we allow any student to take the SAT where other states only allow certain students take it. Comparing apples to apples, SC students rank up among the top with their peers from other states.
Sadly, the only thing that has been accomplished over the last 4 years is for the governor to convince the state that there is no hope for public schools.
I am tired of all of this hate being spewed. All of you on this board who are so anti- public schools, why not go and visit your local schools. Speak to dedicated teachers, volunteer to tutor a student, join a school improvement council.
Actually, my school was integrated in 1963, but the NAACP had to import some students from out of state, because the local black school was so much nicer than ours.
“Disaggregate SAT scores and you will see that even though our scores are low, we allow any student to take the SAT where other states only allow certain students take it. Comparing apples to apples, SC students rank up among the top with their peers from other states.”
And how exactly would we do this? Do you have any links or data to support your assertion?
“I am tired of all of this hate being spewed.”
I’ve been hearing this “hate” crap several times lately. FYI, just because we are highly satisfied with the poor performance of the PS system doesn’t mean we “hate” it, any more than I would “hate” GM for selling me a lemon. I do expect GM to make it right, though, just as I would expect the public schools to get their stuff together. Unfortunately for at least two entire 12-year cycles, they have abysmally failed to do so.
Why can’t parents demand better performance from our schools? Why do you misinterpret that as “hate”? Just as soon as the schools measure up to our expectations, and their own published goals and standards, most parents will probably stop clamoring for school choice.
“We can’t expect to make changes over night.”
No, we can’t – you’re totally correct. But how many decades does it take to not be “overnight”? How many more student cohorts will have to waste 12 years of their lives in a failing system before we start making some serious changes instead of just rearranging the deck chairs and tinkering around the edges?
Brad Warthen and some other people are willing to wait yet another 12 years to see if the latest educrat “reform” will work. To me that is just totally obscene. These are young people’s lives we’re talking about here – why should another generation be sacrificed on the altar of educrat ideology?
Those who educate for profit, and have competition, know that they cannot tell the customers to wait 12 years for improvements. They have to demonstrate visible results before the next semester, or their customers will go elsewhere.
Public schools are run for a profit – the bloated salaries and benefits of useless administrators and their consultant cronies.
FYI, just because we are highly dissatisfied with the poor performance of the PS system…..
Gee Lexie, where do people get the idea that you are spewing hate?
Let’s see, you claim “SC schools are terrible” and disparage educators as “educrats”. You dismiss and disparage anyone who does not drink the koolaid of blind ideological obedience to your “plan” stating they “support failing schools”.
Lexie, do you have ANY data that shows that SC middle and elementary schools are “at the bottom” and are “terrible”? Anything beyond your hate ideology? You keep crying for data from others, do YOU have any? And spare us the link to schoolchoice.org and other related sites.
Charles, excellent points. The public school haters base their blind allegiance to vouchers on two statistics, SAT and droup out rates.
SC is terrible in those areas. What’s conveniently ignored is what exactly do these metrics measure?
The SAT is highly correlated with household income. Also, consider this. I personally increased my SAT score 70 points from doing a couple practice verbal tests (at home on my own) between my first and second try at the SAT. There are 9th graders who score above 1000. Does this mean they should skip the rest of high school because they’ve mastered all the content?
The drop out rate is largely a function of the community and home life. Regardless of what happened at school, my parents would have cut my butt before letting me cut school or drop out. Drop out indicates that a student does not go to school any more. I know at our school we do not stop by every house and drag students onto the bus. BUT it’s the SCHOOL’S FAULT because the student doesn’t go to school any more? Gee, I thought the GOP was for individual responsibility and not government responsibility. That is conservative dogma.
BTW, the percent of South Carolinians 25+ or older who do not have a hs diploma is 24%. The drop out rate is 50%. That indicates that either our drop out rates DOUBLED in the past few years, or this rate is misleading. I’ll give you an example of why it’s the latter. These rates will include students who don’t finish until the summer or the next fall. It’s based on students who finish with their class at the May graduation. AND, SC requires more credits to graduate than most of the other states.
Why would the administrators and educrats be exaggerating the dropout rate?
If it truly is “only” 24%, is that good enough for you?
Could it be that the 1,000,000 adults who moved to SC since 1970 have offset the rates of illiteracy produced by our public schools?
Why don’t educrats and teachers know the answers to these questions, and discuss their problems openly?
You may be correct in saying that private corporations would not last if they told customers to wait 12 years for improvement. Schools are not producing widgets. Public schools did not received “standardized raw materials”- they have to take whatever arrives at the door. There are students who sit in classrooms then go home and play 4-5 hours of video games and then watch 4 hours of television. Parents are more apt to be their child’s friend rather than a disciplinarian. And in this society of playing the blame game, it is much easier for a parent to blame the shortcomings of thier child on the school than on the disengagement of the adults at home.
Lee- “Why would the administrators and educrats be exaggerating the dropout rate?” A little piece of legislation that you may or may not heard of called no Child left Behind sets the parameters for reporting of statistics for public schools. You would perhaps be interested to know that “administrators and educrats” had nothing to do with it. All of it came from Washington, DC and is designed to discredit schools. It is obvioulsy working since people like you and LexWolf are bashing public schools in the state.
Ultimately, this dialogue about vouchers and blaming the schools is most counter-productive. It is the product of the priveleged who now want to get everything they can from the system. They blame the social programs of the 60s and 70s from wasting their hard earned moeny. It is ironic that these people now have an attitude of entitlement. “I am entitled not to have to support the public schools.”
Could it be that the 1,000,000 adults who moved to SC since 1970 have offset the rates of illiteracy produced by our public schools? – Lee
From 2000 to 2005 the % of SC residents with a hs diploma increased from 75 to 80% (Census quick facts). So Lee, make a big fuss about this 20%, but with counties like Allendale and Marlboro, which have a median household income of $11k, this is not a surprise. This 20% is largely due to factors outside of the school system.
What factors?
Some that I have raised before that made you angry and sent you into denial?
Are you admitting that no amount of spending on public education will solve the problem for those 20% of dropouts?
Personally I would prefer to keep my bottles and open…